Rudd wants drinking age lifted to 21
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Kevin Rudd chats to students after last night's Q and A (ABC News: Renee Trezise )
Prime Minister Kevin Rudd says he would personally like the drinking age to be raised to 21 in Australia.
During a forum with 200 young people aired on the ABC's Q&A program last night, Mr Rudd was asked whether he had ever considered lifting the minimum legal drinking age from 18, given the number of young people involved in road accidents.
Mr Rudd said there had been a few discussions about it, and personally "of course" he would like to raise it, but more evidence would be needed in order for it to become policy.
This is the exchange between Mr Rudd and presenter Tony Jones from last night's program:
Tony Jones: "Let's get a specific answer to Linna Wei's question about raising the legal drinking age to 21, would you consider it?"
Kevin Rudd: "I don't have the evidence in front of me to say whether we can or whether we can't. I just want to be straight up with you and say-"
TJ: " Would you like to?"
KR: "Of course! I mean - you mean would I like to?"
TJ: "Would you like to raise the drinking age to 21? - 'Of course!'"
KR: "Ah, I believe in something called evidence based policy, which is if the evidence is there and it's capable of being proven that it works, then we look at these things and make a decision. But you're asking me for a personal impression? We don't run policy that way, Tony."
The Young Liberals have pounced on Mr Rudd's remarks, saying a change to the law would deprive 18-year-olds of their rights as adults.
The national president of the Young Liberals Movement, Richard Wilson, says it would be unacceptable for Mr Rudd to impose such a ban on people over the age of 18.
"The majority of young people are behaving in a very responsible manner and for Government to come in and ban them from having a drink or having a good time is not the right thing to do," he said.
Comments (111)
Comments for this story are closed, but you can still have your say.
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ABC (Moderator):
09 Feb 2010 9:16:04am
Do you agree with Kevin Rudd that the drinking age should be lifted to 21?
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KD:
09 Feb 2010 9:21:38am
No, because the only thing it would achieve is it make drinking illegal for anyone aged 18-20. It wouldn't educate people about binge drinking or excessive drinking, it wouldn't change attitudes towards drinking. It certainly wouldn't do anything about the drinking culture in this country.
When it comes to alcohol and drugs, making law doesn't change anything, only education can do that.Agree (7) Alert moderator
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shayne:
09 Feb 2010 9:25:24am
while his response 'of course' indicates so, it seemed more like a personal view than a policy view. i'd rather see a question posed (re his performance last night) such as: "Did Kevin Rudd actually answer any questions to the satisfaction of the audience, or was it all just political rhetoric and spin?"
he dodged the real answers people wanted to hear, teenagers and older australians alike. we didn't hear anything new, when will politicians/political parties begin to be held accountable for their inaction?Agree (2) Alert moderator
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Ben:
09 Feb 2010 10:15:59am
I saw the program and thought that questions were answered quite directly. Would you be kind enough to offer an example of where he 'dodged' the question?
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Tj:
09 Feb 2010 10:57:38am
Ruddy didn't like the "the buck stops with me question" and he absolutely detested the audience applause on that question being asked.
I doubt very much it was a night of "questions without notice" and this was made noticable by Rudd not wearing a radio talkback earpiece (to keep things gaffe proof).Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Bald Eagle:
09 Feb 2010 10:31:19am
Shayne - I think you watch a different Q&A than I did. The one I watched was in the old parliament building. In this Q&A, Kevin Rudd answered all the questions directly and honestly. You can watch the show I watched on Iview.
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shayne:
09 Feb 2010 10:44:40am
Sorry Bald Eagle - I think the difference was that I was not sucked-in by cheap speak around the real answers people wanted to hear, and was looking for the answer to the question instead. I have watched it, a few times in fact. I suggest you do watch it again and look for the answer to every question posed.
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Greenkiller:
09 Feb 2010 9:33:14am
No, it should remain at 18. If people are allowed to vote, drive and serve in the military at that age then they should be allowed to make, and take responsibility for, their own decisions about drinking alcohol. No more nanny state nonsense.
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MT:
09 Feb 2010 9:55:37am
I used to share that opinion, but now two things are swaying me the other way.
There is good evidence that the brain is not mature at 18, and drinking damages the areas that help with decision making and emotional intelligence more in teens than in adults.
Secondly, I now have children and would like it not to be acceptable for them to be drinking for as long as possible.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Greenkiller:
09 Feb 2010 10:17:47am
I agree the medical evidence indicates a risk to health, but bans don't work, MT. There are plenty of kids under 18 who drink alcohol already. It's the same with illicit drugs - if you drive it underground you'll lose sight of it, but you won't get rid of it and you could make things worse.
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Si:
09 Feb 2010 10:10:28am
Voting is an essential part of our democracy, driving is an essential requirement for a lot of employment, and the armed forces are an essential act of patriotism in service to the nation. How exactly is hitting the snakes essential, or even desirable?
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HeathD:
09 Feb 2010 10:35:55am
Drinking alcohol, or taking drugs, are an essential release in a world that demands people forgo half their waking lives in the service of someone else. It is a human response to a contradictory existance.
People who make saintly proclaimations that 'people shouldn't drink' have their heads confused with a utopian vision of what the world is and what people are like.
If you never drink, if you never take drugs, if you never get your release by BASE jumping or excessive exercise, then you must contain a very simple, unstimulated mind. reality must be very boring to be so tolerable and so constant.Agree (2) Alert moderator
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rocky:
09 Feb 2010 10:45:33am
serving in the armed forces an essential act of patriotism? okaaay.
You would say that someone who is 18 is not mature enough to be legally allowed to buy a drink in a bar, but is mature enough to ship overseas and shoot foreigners.
riiight.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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atmurray:
09 Feb 2010 10:47:17am
because if you accept the responsibility of all those things, you deserve some rights to make them worthwhile.
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Peter D:
09 Feb 2010 10:16:19am
But.....that's obviously the problem right now....a huge number of these young people AREN't taking that responsibility seriously enough. Drinking like driving should be treated as an earned privelage not a right.
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Kevin:
09 Feb 2010 10:20:36am
Greenkiller, most people younger than 21 don't understand the concept of "responsibility". But then, as that sheila said on that show that time: maybe with the drought, the kids are just getting thirstier and thirstier.
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Mick:
09 Feb 2010 10:40:15am
you can join the army at 17... before you can vote and drink... i heard they do want to lift the driving age to 21 too which wouldnt be too bad considering everyday we hear of teens killing themselves by wrapping cars around poles... they could lift the voting age whilst they are at it
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Lil0:
09 Feb 2010 9:34:42am
No, It would make it extremely inconvenient to everyone aged 18-20 who alredy go out and drink, including the bars themselves who would lose a large portion of their customers and it would cut jobs for everyone in that age who work in bars as a second job.
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luke warm:
09 Feb 2010 9:35:53am
Having watched the show, I do not believe that this report accurately represents what happened. Is there a recording somewhere? I believe that Jones initially asked something like 'Do you agree with that?' to which Rudd said 'Of Course' BUT there was a misunderstanding between them over what Jones was actually asking.
Rudd was quite clear in saying that if there was evidence that raising the drinking age to 21 did result in fewer accidents it would be grounds to take it on as policy.Agree (2) Alert moderator
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Pun Gent:
09 Feb 2010 9:38:12am
I doubt it'd do all that much good. Unless you changed the minimum drinking age to something like 40, you're still going to get youthful exhuberance leading to a significant proportion of alcohol abusers... From what I can tell (although admittedly I am no expert and haven't researched the issue in depth, so I'm willing to be proved wrong) there isn't a significantly reduced incidence of alcohol-related problems in somewhere like America, where the drinking age is 21, as compared to Australia...
Legally, 18-year-olds are considered responsible enough to choose who leads our nation, to live on their own and make their own choices about what foods they eat etc, to serve in our military, and to be considered responsible for their criminal actions and tried in "adult" courts for their crimes. Why should choices about alcohol be any different than choices about who to vote for or whether they should kill someone? Unless you raise the minimum age for all the rest of it, it will be difficult to justify the change for legal drinking...
I'd like to see data that shows what differences (if any) exist between problem drinking (crime, accidents, health problems, consumption levels, etc) in those aged 18, compared to those aged 21... I doubt 21-year-olds are all that much more responsible in their drinking habits than 18-year-olds... Perhaps a little more experienced in knowing their limits, etc, but that's probably more to do with their extra years of drinking experience rather than their greater inherent maturity per se.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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L:
09 Feb 2010 9:38:23am
I don't even agree that events occured as the ABC have reported them. I think it is beat-up reporting. When did Naomi Robson start working for ABC Online?
Kevin Rudd repeated "of course, of course" while the questioner was describing how there is a perception of a high youth road toll. I think he was agreeing with the questioners assertion that the number of young people killed on the road is high. She followed up by drawing a link between the age people can drink in Australia and the age they can drive. Kevin Rudd slipped one more "of course" in there which I think came out before he processed the question.
It's bad enough that the ABC Online can't quote numbers correctly, use correct grammar, or even spelling, but now you make up stories from a trivial slip of the tongue?
I believe the young people that made the effort to attend last night would be disappointed that the only story to come out of it was this rubbish. Why not report on the claim that it was the world's most popular twitter theme, or report on young people's vision for Australia's future.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Earl Fondleroy Fitzainous:
09 Feb 2010 9:40:46am
It won't help in the slightest - some people should never drink full stop - makes no difference what their age but you can't legislate for this.
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MT:
09 Feb 2010 9:57:29am
but you can legislate to make it harder for teens to get alcohol
dont let the perfect be the enemy of the goodAgree (0) Alert moderator
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Mary:
09 Feb 2010 10:31:35am
How can you make it harder for teens to get alcohol.
It is very easy now, what can you change.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Tim Hoff:
09 Feb 2010 10:06:02am
This is true. Some individuals (regardless of age) shouldn't drink or be given a licence to drive.
IMO if one was to delve into the statistics you will likely find that a good percentage of road offenders (both alcohol and traffic) would have sociopathic characteristics right back to when they were at school.
There'd be pattern violence / bullying / recklessness / drunkenness / vandalism etc etc regardless of age.
They are in the minority though with the vast majority being mature enough at 18.
Maybe the law should recognise 'trivial' juvenile offences and suspend the ability to gain drivers licences and proof of age cards to budding sociopaths?....maybe we should all have a licence to drink just as we have one to drive?Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Tim:
09 Feb 2010 9:42:09am
Actually Rudd *didn't* say he wanted the drinking age lifted - I saw it and the 'of course' was a slip of the tongue - he immediately backed off, saying he would need evidence to justify a move like that
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Yagu:
09 Feb 2010 9:50:38am
No, I don't agree. People aged 18 to 21 are allowed to vote, drive a car, marry, indulge in consensual sex, see MA movies, serve in our Armed forces, fight for our Country, receive Medicare and Social security and work for a living-they are treated as adults. We, including the Government, need to stop treating 18-21 year olds as fools and people who are unable to make their own decisions as to wether they should or should not drink. Trust me, kids know that alcohol is harmful to them just as it is to a 40 year old.
I'd rather Kevin Rudd stop pontificating on these matters and trying to run PR campaigns on himself and can get on with the job of fulfilling his election promises and running the country which thus far he seems to be failing abysmally in!Agree (0) Alert moderator
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atmurray:
09 Feb 2010 10:52:17am
I completely agree with everything you've said except... 18 to 21 year olds are adults, not kids. :)
As you're implying, society has largely identified 18 as the age at which you become an adult.
We shouldn't go blurring this line as it create a whole series of problems.
E.g. if someone is charged with a criminal offence at the age of 19, should they be prosecuted as a youth or adult?
Let's just agree that 18 is the age of "adulthood" and then directly dealing with society's problems as a whole rather than demonising small groups of it.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Ed:
09 Feb 2010 9:58:12am
This story is a beat up - I saw the interview.
Tony Jones & Kevin Rudd misunderstood each other.
Kevin said "of course" to the question he thought was "would you like to see the evidence for drinking age being raised to 21?"... not "would you like to see the age raised?"
They're getting real sloppy at the ABC.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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richard:
09 Feb 2010 10:05:38am
I would raise the drinking age for spirits to 21.
I'd also like to see a photo-id smart card based drinkers licence similar to a driver's licence. Each time you bought a drink it registers on your smart card and once the limit for your card is reached for a given time period the card would show the licensee that you had reached the limit and it would be an offence to sell you more. The card would include a photo. If you were the designated driver it could be electronically marked as 0 drinks for the designated time period.
Clubs, pubs, bottle shops etc would have a reader that logged each purchase. They could be cheaply hired for parties. Ideally a 'joint-licence' device could be issued by clubs or pubs so that friends could pool their credits for a very limited time (~4 minutes) and one of them could go to the bar and get drinks for all. i.e. each has their card read by the joint device which transfers one drink credit from the device to the 'joint licence' which would then be taken to the bar where the credit would be transferred to the publican as the drinks were purchased.
Like a drivers licence it would have points which would be debited for bad behaviour and the card could be suspended.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Mike:
09 Feb 2010 10:17:43am
Yes. US states had all increased the drinking age to 21 by 1988. The number of high school students drinking fell by about 40% and the number of road deaths of drunk drivers aged 16-20 fell by 1000 per year.
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Jim:
09 Feb 2010 10:20:45am
Yes, and the minimum legal age to purchase tobacco products was also raised to 21.
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Brad:
09 Feb 2010 10:29:05am
What about smoking?
My thought has always been that if the Government is serious about eliminating the ill effects of smoking in our community then it seems logical to progressively lift the legal age by 1 each year until you need to be 100 to smoke (which it could then be banned).
Alcohol is a major issue too - I'm just unsure why smoking hasn't been tackled first.Agree (1) Alert moderator
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oh really:
09 Feb 2010 10:49:25am
If they are binge drinking at 15 and 16 and 17 where the drink age is already 18 then what difference does it make?
We use teenage binge drinking as an excuse to raise revenue by increasing taxes, then we ignore the root cause of the problem.
We live in a culture of booze and a value of respect for others has gone out the window. If we don't respect then over time we ourselves get less respect. If we feel disrespected, then over time we start to believe that we're not worthy of self-respect. Then, we start behaving in self-destructive ways. We need to, as a society, arrest this fall in respect.
Government, laws and taxes can't help with that.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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lizzieme:
09 Feb 2010 10:52:17am
Yeah, great idea Kev... it works so well in the USA! How about we put a bit more effort into education and health instead rather than a token gesture such as this?
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tony:
09 Feb 2010 11:01:25am
No, but we should move to raise the DRIVING age to 21, especially for males.
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matthias:
09 Feb 2010 9:16:58am
although i agree the legal drinking age should be increased i doubt it will make much difference as many teenagers get their alcohol underage already
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sdf:
09 Feb 2010 9:46:05am
my 15 year old nephew has been drinking excessively for at least 12 months so I dont imagine changing the law in this case will help. I assume he get older friends to buy it for him but that can still continue.
i think raising the drinking age would make people more aware of the seriousness of the drinking which is a good thing.
The kids will continue to smoke dope and pop pills or do that even more because of more difficult access to alcohol.
Absent parents seem to be the most consistent factor in young and under-age drinkers... i wonder if Ruddy can make a law against this.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Lauren:
09 Feb 2010 9:19:43am
I don't believe it will make a difference. I see the issues faced with binge and teen drinking as related to a growing lack of values, particularly on the home front. People need to take more personal responsibility.
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croozza:
09 Feb 2010 9:30:01am
Yes, as times change so do laws that govern them, the current crop of 18-21 year olds dont show enough restraint towards alcohol, and the carnage that they have caused whilst under the influence is horrific to say the least. BUt the law should not crack down on just them, it is also the older (supposedly adult) persons that need to be looked at also.
Yes I do drink alcohol, but I am responsible and wont drink that much so that it would put myself or others in danger. Have fun when you have a drink, but dont wreck the day/night for others.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Lukemac:
09 Feb 2010 9:30:41am
I think its a big issue of when you become an adult.
If your old enough to drive, fight in the army and vote, then your old enough to drink.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Wal:
09 Feb 2010 9:31:39am
While we are about it lets lift the drivers license to 21, no sex or marriages before 21, no voting until 21, no adult material of any kind until 21. Lets make everything 21
Get real Rudd and save the country before you push you ideals on the unsuspectedAgree (0) Alert moderator
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L:
09 Feb 2010 10:15:15am
Whilst I appreciate your views, you've got to be dreaming Wal.
Children and young people are the biggest drivers of consumption and whether you like it or not (I don't), consumption is what it's all about at the end of the day.
Marketing firms and manufacturers work together to push products (most of which we don't need) and young people are the most vulnerable to marketing. They push parents and heavily influence their consumption patterns. GDP is a measure of consumption, and that is how we describe our economy. Like it or not that's how the world works mate.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Barry:
09 Feb 2010 9:32:28am
It won't really achieve anything. Idiotic parents will continue to supply their children and their parties with alcohol. I wonder what would have happened if Abbot had been asked the same question and had given a similar answer. Probably an uproar about a religious do-gooder trying to spoil everyone's fun and control our lives . . . . . . . . .
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al:
09 Feb 2010 9:44:23am
"I wonder what would have happened if Abbot had been asked the same question and had given a similar answer. Probably an uproar about a religious do-gooder trying to spoil everyone's fun and control our lives..."
I agree this is exactly what Kevin Rudd's like...oh sorry you were talking about Abbott? Yet another example of the electorate's 'choice' narrowingAgree (1) Alert moderator
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Greymalkin:
09 Feb 2010 9:54:49am
Hit the nail on the head there Barry.
Interesting (yet unfortunately not surprising) that one politician being asked for a personal opinion gets hysterically reported as him being an out of touch mysoginist. Yet a few weeks later a personal opinion is clearly represented as such.
I suppose the ABC has learnt their lesson from Chaser and Internet censorship proposals. Chairman Rudd is not amused and all his carefully fence sitting responses are to be reported as he decrees.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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miranda:
09 Feb 2010 9:32:31am
The problem with drinking in Australia isn't age, it's the culture/attitudes of both young people and adults who encourage drinking to the point where they cannot image any event or occasion without it, or create occasions just for getting completely wasted. Raising the age will not fix this - what needs to be addressed is why people (of all ages) are drinking so much so regularly.
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Arrow:
09 Feb 2010 9:58:12am
exactly miranda.
in the US the drinking age is 21 and they have binge drinking and a "drink to get drunk" attitude just like here.
contrast with, say, France, where alcohol is seen as a accompaniment to food, not a method of social release, and they have a much more mature and restrained attitude to drinking - even though they start earlier.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Barney:
09 Feb 2010 9:32:33am
Introduce a provisional system for alcohol. Beer and wine at 18 then spirits at 21. Any alcohol related conviction and you stay on your "P's" for longer.
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Dave:
09 Feb 2010 9:42:05am
There is a very similar system in Germany. The age for beer and wine is 16, and for spirits 18. Even though the age limits are lower in this case I do believe the Germans have got the right idea in this matter. I think that a system like this would work very well in Australia.
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Wal:
09 Feb 2010 10:00:56am
Unless you are the poor barperson that has to monitor it with HUGE fines for the barperson and the establishment if you make a slip. Thats not taking into consideration the older one buying it for them.
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Jon:
09 Feb 2010 9:56:02am
Main problem with this is policing in pubs/clubs...bar staff would then need to decide who is the correct age to order which drink. Difficult when the place is very busy.
Would require different coloured stamps or wrist bands each time you go into a club.
A good idea for sure, but implementation might be complicated.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Dan:
09 Feb 2010 9:33:15am
Instead they should raise the taxes on alcohol and cigs to better reflect the great personal and social damage these drugs cause. They should also legalise drugs such as weed ecstacy speed cocaine and heroin. These should be made legal for personal use and treated as a health and education issue. The price would go down and so would most property crime which is linked to raising money to buy drugs. These drugs cause less damage than alcohol and cigs and thats saying something. The only people who benefit from making these drugs illegal are the crooks crooked cops judges and polis on the take.
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ABC 4 ALP:
09 Feb 2010 9:34:28am
That would be a good thing.
But just a minute. Didn't Mr Abbot cop vitriolic abuse from Ms Gillard for preaching to ALL Australian women recently re his hypothetical advice to ONLY his children? Didn't the ABC join in?
I shall keep watching throughout the day for the fair and balanced report of Ms Gillard's response to this. I shall also watch for the Drum opinion piece attacking Rudd for meddling in youth affairs.Agree (2) Alert moderator
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Jed:
09 Feb 2010 9:34:43am
It's not for me to judge whether changing the legal age of drinking would have an impact on the "Drinking culture" in Australia but I do believe it would be sending a much clearer message to younger Australians about their responsibilities in relation to drink driving. We learned of a devastating car accident just a few short weeks ago in Victoria where 4 teens under 21 lost thgeir lives as a result of drink driving. The young driver, under 21, was 5 times the legal limit. If the legal age of drinking was raised to 21 then a zero tolerance policy in relation to young drivers would certainly have the potential to impact on our road tolls and save young lives. That's got to be a positive thing!
I watched Q&A last night and was greatly impressed with the level of engagement of our young folk and I was equally impressed with Kevin Rudd who put himself front and centre to answer the concerns of young Australians. I can't ever remember Howard, Keating or Hawke doing anything like it. Well done Kev, it took some courage to take some HOT questions without notice from our young folk on national TV.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Ann:
09 Feb 2010 10:14:22am
You must have watched a different program to a lot of us. If he had said 'just let me say this' one more time our telly would have bben thrown out. As usual not one question was answered completely and without the usual political mantra. What a sham! Many of the audience were obviuosly disappointed in his responses. I guess it was put on by the ABC to counter his abysmal performance on Rove
When will Tony Abbott be given the same opportunity ???Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Jed:
09 Feb 2010 10:40:57am
Ann - you should have left your political partisan baggage at the front door...there were many ovations from the audience in response to Kevins answers and I was rather impressed with he and the young audience. I think the truth is that you would find fault with Kevin if he walked on water!.
When will Tony Abbot seek the same opportunity???Agree (0) Alert moderator
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mik:
09 Feb 2010 9:34:44am
Just how drunk do you have to be to come up with an idea like that? what difference would it make when they cant uphold the current laws that say you have to be 18 to drink.
"Beam me back to LA LA land"Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Robert:
09 Feb 2010 9:35:54am
Impractical, unenforceable and without logic given that we allow 18 year olds to vote.
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MT:
09 Feb 2010 10:01:19am
hardly
if we can enforce an 18 yr limit then we can manage to enforce a 21 yr limit
wont be perfect, but then nothing isAgree (0) Alert moderator
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Jern Ingham:
09 Feb 2010 9:37:01am
It looked like Kevin actually was out of time...and said the wrong words. Has anyone actually asked him after the event if this was not a slip up on his behalf?????
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AdamG:
09 Feb 2010 9:38:09am
I agree with the prime minister's suggestion of an evidence based strategy to minimise the risk to society from alcohol related social issues. What I don't agree with is any suggestion that one arbitrary line in the sand (18) is any better than another arbitrary line in the sand.
So if the PM wants to move the drinking age, I think it should be moved to age 75 and then only for people who have remained in the workforce (thereby contributing to another policy goal of delaying retirement to increase national productivity).
The real question is, what issue is the PM trying to smokescreen such that he tactlessly drags this onto the agenda?Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Plain and Simple:
09 Feb 2010 9:39:05am
The statement - "But I believe in something called evidence-based policy, which is if the evidence is there and it's capable of being proven and it works, then we look at these things and make a decision," - is quite amusing..... maybe based on the evidence that his tenure as the prime minister is backed by a lack of actual leadership, would he step down? Typical Rudd there, not actually ever focussing on the problem.
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NorthCoaster:
09 Feb 2010 9:44:41am
And how will that stop the 12-16 olds who already drink illegally?
Better parenting is needed not lifting the drinking age.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Fair Go:
09 Feb 2010 9:45:04am
Will there be outrage expressed that the PM dares to tell "18-20 yo's to not drink" as per the outrage expressed over Abbott's hypothetical advice to his daughters? After all the PM is discussing legislation, not advice to his children. (Or is the PM just trying to "do an Abbott" and look like a caring but respectful social conservative?)
C'mon Ms Gillard and co., what about, "How dare this man consider imposing his wowserism on the free-wheeling Aussie larrikin?"Agree (1) Alert moderator
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Jack:
09 Feb 2010 10:04:44am
Fair Go - exactly the sentiments of many I would think, but what I would really like to see is Julia involved in a discussion like this, and then have the media run amok with her "personal views".
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Ogo:
09 Feb 2010 9:45:41am
All pubs and clubs to close at eleven and not re-open untill eleven in the morning.
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Damian:
09 Feb 2010 9:45:42am
no single measure will help this problem. Raising the age is one of the things that should be considered along with other measures.
This is now a real problem. It is every where even in cricket clubs where young boys are involved.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Bob:
09 Feb 2010 9:47:47am
So Kevin thinks it is a good idea but it is not the overall view/poicy of the party. Personal opinion and party policy in this case are different things and thankfully, the ABC has kept the full comment made by him about 'evidence-based policy' whereas other outlets are painting a different picture...
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gazza305:
09 Feb 2010 9:47:47am
For those that did not watch the show, Rudd did not indicate any plans or moves to undertakes such action. He was simply asked a question on the matter and replied that he supports evidence based approaches to policy. Let's not beat this up.
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Ann:
09 Feb 2010 10:17:30am
And neither did TA advocate banning sex before marriage but that didn't stop all the red raggers out there blowing it out of all proportion. ALP supporters can give it but can't take it , a fact we allready are aware of.
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A_Drug_and_Alc_Medico:
09 Feb 2010 9:47:52am
Here's a prediction: In fifty years, we'll look back and be appalled at the damage that we allowed to happen to growing adolescent brains. The alcohol problem now is analogous to the tobacco problem of the 60's and 70's- as is the producing industry's response. The more I know about what alcohol does to kids, the more worried I get. A first step is to make public moves which send a message that alcohol is a very big problem, raising the drinking age is one policy response to get that ball rolling.
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SG:
09 Feb 2010 9:50:27am
I am a Secondary Physical Education teacher who "Educates" young people everyday about drugs, alcohol and road safety. Students these days get more then enough information on all of these areas as well as decision making skills. So to say that they need education.... They get it. It is certainly not an educational problem, it is a cultural problem. It is at the moment socially acceptable to get "wasted" etc. We need to change our culture and moral standings towards these issues that are killing our youth.
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Wayne A:
09 Feb 2010 9:50:49am
And increasing the drinking age will do just what? under age drinking is wide spread now when the legal age is 18......
Just like regardless of legal age for driving under aged kids still drive.....and in some cases are drunk........why do they do it? because of little or no penalty if caughtAgree (0) Alert moderator
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Joe Monterrubio:
09 Feb 2010 9:51:51am
No, I don't think that the drinking age should be raised.
As KD and Lauren have pointed out the measure would not change the culture of excessive drinking that exists.
A better response to the problem of alcohol-fuelled anti-social behaviour would be to enforce laws that already exist: Responisble Service of Alcohol.
RSA law in WA says that serving staff should not serve alcohol to the point where a patron become intoxicated and should refuse entry to an intoxicated person to a licenced premises. Fines of breaching RSA are five and ten thousand dollars for the serving staff member and manager respectively- although the figures may have changed since I did an RSA course three years ago.
Surely it's possible for eighteen to twenty year olds to drink responsibly, so why not make this easier for the punters by rigorously enforcing the law requiring bar staff to say "sorry mate, you've already had enough"?Agree (0) Alert moderator
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NT Girl:
09 Feb 2010 9:51:53am
It just wouldnt work, kids that are underage now already have access to alcohol, legally once you turn 18 you are classed as an Adult, your own person, you have finished school want to enjoy life before settling down in the future, i do not agree with the binge drinking but hey if thats what the kids want to do then no one can stop them not even the legal drinking age being lifted to 21. I do agree it does have to do with some form of education but they are kids they like to experiment. You tell them dont do something and they are going to do it to see what it is like, whether the legal drinking age is changed it most likely wont make a difference, just 18-20 yr old ADULTS being arrested for drinking or getting fined all the time, is that why Rudd wants the legal age changed so he can get more money out of young Australians for having a good time
Most of the politicians have enjoyed celebrating their 18th and 21st i no i have but now they want to try and change the laws because they are getting old and dont remember their younger days when they ran amuck.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Jeff:
09 Feb 2010 9:55:20am
What a load of C**P my son is 18y old and has just joined the Australian Army.
So if this goes though he can not buy a beer in Australia but he can die for it in battle.
What next, telling us what we can eat each night and what time we must go to bed.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Beagle:
09 Feb 2010 10:53:25am
I hardly think that we should formulate a strategy based on your desire for your son to have a drink, regardless of the military connection.
In the U.S. during the vietnam war, drinking ages were lowered to 18 for exactly the same reason you point out. The argument went like this. "if I'm old enough to fight and die for my country, I'm old enough to drink" Not too long after the war ended, the drinking age in all U.S. states was raised the 21.
When you are in the military, if you learn one thing it is to follow orders.
If evidence can show that raising the drinking age to 21 can save many lives, then I'm all for it. It might save a few brain cells as well.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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SG:
09 Feb 2010 10:00:26am
This will never happen , too much taxes to lose.
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Ravensclaw:
09 Feb 2010 10:01:33am
This is just another prepared "nanny state" stunt to gauge community reaction to either another or an increased alcohol tax.
Rudd hasn't really done much since becoming PM, and he's become a little upset that Abbott has used his time in the media spotlight to some success. Rudd has also been under pressure on his promises he has not fulfilled, the buck he is continually passing and the fat taxes he wants to introduce but is being stifled on.
Rudd is critical of young people and reckless drinking, but people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. There was a time not so long ago when a 40 something morally conservative christian parliamentarian went to the USA representing Australia and spent time getting very drunk in a very naughty stripper bar.
Shame Kev shame.
CheersAgree (0) Alert moderator
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gazza1:
09 Feb 2010 10:04:22am
Prohibition of any sort does not work.
What has to be done is getting rid off - as quickly as possible - the boozy concept of "mate-ship", and the 'you-cannot-have-fun-without-getting-pissed' attitude so prevalent in the Australian society!Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Beagle:
09 Feb 2010 10:57:50am
Prohibition of any sort does not work?
No one is talking about prohibition. The discussion is about raising the drinking age to 21, not prohibiting alcohol.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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jockmclock:
09 Feb 2010 10:05:08am
waste of time . it took 40 years for me to learn to drink responsibly. Couldnt stand the hangovers anymore,
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Young Fello:
09 Feb 2010 10:06:07am
I completely agree with many of the other comments from this forum. I was at the filming and I can only hope that the transcript will show that his "Of course" comment is being taken completely out of context.
From memory he was replying to whether he would like to have available further evidence on the benefits of raising the drinking age.
I too think it's just embarrassing how the media has run with such a blatant beat up - just what else do you guys take out of context?Agree (0) Alert moderator
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the straight shooter:
09 Feb 2010 10:07:53am
its pretty simple : you are the head of the country so less talk and more action ! just put it in place tomorrow and while your doing it also do it with the legal driving age too ! this generation are out of control because the government removed the strap from schools and that's when i started to notice the change. the strap was removed when i was in my last year at tech school. don't judge my comment i just tell it how i see it !
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Elsie:
09 Feb 2010 10:08:03am
Yes, I think the legal drinking age should be 21 - but then, I think the age to vote, drive a car, serve the country in the armed forces, marry, take out bank loans etc. should be raised to 21 also. All these youngsters wanting to be adults - let them live a few years after they're 18 and get some more life experience under their belts before they take on the responsibilities. It was cynical politicians who gave the 18 year olds all these responsibilities, in an effort to garner votes.
The key of the door should still come at 21, not 18.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Marty:
09 Feb 2010 10:08:32am
First he wants to censor the internet, now he wants to raise the legal drinking age, he won't be happy until the whole country hates him.
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MiWe:
09 Feb 2010 10:08:32am
No I don't agree. The issue lies firmly in the hands of parents and a free wheeling society that thinks it's ok to not "just have a few with your mates" but to get blind drunk as well, preferably at the pub on a friday arvo, at your mate"s place on a Saturday arvo, at the Sunday session and then work off the hangover at school or work for the rest of the week.
Kevin Rudd needs to get real and stop wasting taxpayers' monies on overseas trips and poorly conceived ETS schemesAgree (0) Alert moderator
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Becky:
09 Feb 2010 10:43:51am
I believe that the better solution would be to take heed of the evidence that is already out there and close the licensed premises at a reasonable time. It is already KNOWN that the longer in any day that alcohol is available the more crime, drunk drivers and unsociable behaviour result. Quite simple really. The statistics were published in the SMH some time ago after a determined journalist pursued them via the FOI Act. And regarding the U.S.A. even New York City, the city that never sleeps, has a curfew on trading times for licensed premises.
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Mike:
09 Feb 2010 10:09:11am
In America all 50 states and the DC have the drinking age set at 21. From casual comments I've observed on chat channels, Americans under 21 accept that as the norm and generally respect the law. It would be interesting to see a comparative study of drink impacted behaviour of Australians and Americans in the 18-20 age group. Certainly in Australia a portion of the population have developed irresponsible drinking habits that appear to be tenuously linked to age.
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Shane Pike:
09 Feb 2010 10:10:21am
We MUST raise the drinking age to 21.
Teenagers are nowhere near mature enough to start to get drunk.
And getting drunk is what drinking is all about.
We need an alternative to idiot juice (alcohol).
We MUST legaise marijuana to give people a much safer alternative.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Peter D:
09 Feb 2010 10:12:34am
YES. Raise the drinking age to 21. That way we've got about 3 or 4 years to instill a sense of responsibility into the young minds who commence driving at 17 y o without the added distraction of booze.
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phil:
09 Feb 2010 10:13:40am
Is this the same person that is ,considering lowering the voting age to 16 years?
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jd:
09 Feb 2010 10:16:42am
Australians are alcoholics, it makes no difference what the drinking age is because by and large it ends in alcoholism regardless. The drinking culture in Australia is too negative. Nothing will ever curb the violence or the stupidity or damage because the culture itself supports the violence, the stupidity and the damage. Epic fail Australia, epic fail.
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Glenn:
09 Feb 2010 10:50:39am
I'll drink to that, you're right, I just realised if I gave up drinking I'd have no friends, how twisted is that ?
Change the culture, but get clever advice on how to do it dont leave it to the polititians who are hopeless.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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BB:
09 Feb 2010 10:23:34am
Based on the lack of success of police in my area in controlling the drinking of even 14 and 15-year-olds, I don't give them a snow-flake's chance in hell of also controlling 18 to 20 year-olds.
It's stupid and meaningless legislation unless you have the resources to enforce it.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Sean:
09 Feb 2010 10:26:51am
Rather than increase the age, why not make it illegal for anyone to be in a public place, including a pub or bar, having an alcohol limit above a certain amount. This would also take habitual drunks off our streets whatever their age.
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Glenn:
09 Feb 2010 10:31:53am
Mr Rudd hasn't thought this one through, this just cost him every vote under 21 - GOOD !
What should be done here is to have some laws that are enforced STRONGLY
You cant drive a car over .05 so why should you be allowed to roam the steeets at .2 ?
Venues shouldn't be allowed to serve drinks without responsibility and drinkers shouldnt be allowed to get themselves very drunk and cause trouble, hefty fines at the very least for both.Agree (0) Alert moderator
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kel:
09 Feb 2010 10:32:59am
prohabition causes problems....if ruddy decides to lift the drinking age to 21 then instead of teenagers rolling into the grog shops for booze, they are likely to call their "dealer" for the same effect. Good one ruddy way to lose taxpayers money you so desperately need
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Ellis:
09 Feb 2010 10:38:54am
As it has been proven that the brain is still developing until age 22, and that alcohol intake before that age does more damage than afterwards, it would make sense if the law reinforced that message by raising the age-limit. It may not prevent the majority from drinking anyway, but at least there would not be mixed messages about what is safe behaviour. The same should be done for cigarettes (seeing as they aren't going to ban them completely).
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Becky:
09 Feb 2010 10:40:06am
Actually it was all very illuminating despite the fact that the questions were probably vetted. But even given that, Rudd looked pretty bad, extremely uncomfortable if not rattled and DEFINITELY did not answer anything directly. Judging from the looks on the faces of the audience, they did not believe him, thankfully demonstrating a healthy scepticism. And we all know that the drinking age is not going to be raised to 21 as that would offend the AHA upon whose support the political parties, especially the Labor party, are dependent. Mustn't upset them! But none of the answers was answered well and Rudd clearly has a very difficult time seeming to be sincere. It's all about KRUDD.
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Lu:
09 Feb 2010 10:40:36am
I believe there was a reference to young people learning to drive. Lifting the drinking age to 21 will do very little to eliminate alcohol related driving incidents. If you get your P-plates at 16, you have to maintain a ZERO BLOOD ALCOHOL level while driving for the three year duration of your P-plates, taking you to the ripe old age of 19/20 depending on when your birthday falls. As is demonstrated over and over, age has nothing to do with someone's propensity to drink and drive. How often do we see accidents caused by people driving under the influence of alcohol regardless of age.
If you really want to address the issue of youth statistics in vehicle accidents, educate young drivers more adequately. Encourage driver education in schools, have a system similar to that required to get your motorcycle license where competence is asessed ever before you get on the road and power restrictions are placed on vehicles (power to weight ratios). It is ridiculous that a teenager can drive a modern V6 with far more output than a much older V8 i.e. my partner's 1977 Holden Premier V8 is not legal for a P-plater to drive however a modern V6 with far more output is, (eg Toyota Aurion 200kw output).
Nothing will change until attitudes do. Good luck with that......Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Russell:
09 Feb 2010 10:40:42am
Just like good ol' Uncle Sam! So now it is the PM's turn to be out of touch with reality. Prohibition doesn't work - we need to teach responsible drinking. I have 3 teenagers and like it or not, if they want to drink they will drink. So at 18 they are old enough to drive a car, old enough to vote. Old enough to join the armed forces and kill people. And legally they can hae sex from 16.
Binge drinking and violence are the real problem, if my kids are out and about with friends I spend 1% of my time worrying about whether they are drinking - and 99% worrying about whether a gang will set on them and beat them to death. If everyone walked around drunk and happy then would we have a problem?Agree (0) Alert moderator
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traffic:
09 Feb 2010 10:45:00am
I agree with the PM. Maybe it should only affect the people who have not turned 18 yet say from 1st July 2010 when you turn 18 you need to wait til your 21 to drink or maybe limited consumption of alcohol for 18 to 21 yr old's. Start with your L plate (18Yrs) limits you to 1 or 2 drinks and then P plate (19 & 20 yrs) 2 or 3 drinks.So when they go out or to a bottle shop they are limited to what they can buy.
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Glenn:
09 Feb 2010 10:47:02am
The lawmakers have to get out there and start kicking some serious butt.
You cannot reduce the drinking age now there would be civil war.
What you can do is introduce laws that prevent people under 21 from drinking shots and hard liquor, stick to wine and beer.
AND make it illegal for those blood sucking beverage companies producing products designed to appeal to young people, alcopops or whatever - NOT ON !Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Rhonda:
09 Feb 2010 10:52:42am
I'd like to suggest that if parents have been found to have supplied their children with alcohol then they too need to be fined .
( I would include licensed premises also.)Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Maureen:
09 Feb 2010 10:54:43am
It would be nice in a perfect world. In years gone by no one under the age of 21 could drink alcohol on licensed premises, but they sure did manage to drink alcohol elsewhere. Does Mr Rudd also want to raise the voting age to 21 years and no military enlistment under the age of 21years?
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Angus:
09 Feb 2010 10:57:18am
Australians growing up, historically give 'the finger' to establishment rules & regulations........When the drinking age 'was 21' I use to get into it like no tomorrow. When I turned 21 & legal I didn't bother anymore, no challenge!
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gonzo:
09 Feb 2010 11:02:27am
the knee jerk reaction says, 'do it!'
but on second thought, the Europeans generally allow drinking at 16 and don't have anywhere near the same problems with alcohol that we do, hmm.
maybe it's the culture around drinking that really needs to change?Agree (0) Alert moderator
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Emmerage:
09 Feb 2010 11:04:53am
Many, many young people start drinking by the age of 15. Making the legal age 21 will have no impact on youth binge drinking - and may in fact make it worse, as some kids will see 21 as an impossibly distant age and therefore do what all their mates do and start getting trashed towards the end of year nine/beginning of year ten. It's virtually a right of passage in your School Certificate year, and changing the age will not change the culture.
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Ted:
09 Feb 2010 11:06:25am
The only way to solve the drinking problem is to make it illegal to be over .05 in public.Why should the public be put at risk by selfish people who abuse drink in access at the expense of public safety and the health system.
If you dont want to be responsible for your actions and get pissed in public cause fights damage property and kill people drink driving you might as well get locked up in jail.This years Australia day celebrations were frightening.If your serious about this issue Mr Rudd how about heavy fines and a few jail terms, ban all alchol advertising and run real campaigns that tell the real story of what alchol does to your brain.
Raising the drinking age wont stop kids wasting themselves because of low self esteem and a sense of no future.If we as a society dont solve this drinking issue very soon we will have larger dangerous riots more damaged property and blood in the streets, what will the goverment do then, bring in the army and shoot the crazy drunking mobs terrorizing the public every weekend.Why should our police forces be tied up having to deal with this issue every weekend.
Its disgraceful.
TedAgree (0) Alert moderator
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